Pino Palladino

[Guest Nore]

Interview :

You've been splitting your time lately between the studio and touring. How do you decide when to focus on sessions and when to take a road gig?

To be honest, I don't get offered a lot of road gigs, so I feel like when a special opportunity comes along, such as D'Angelo or the Who or Simon & Garfunkel, I have to take it. But my main career is session work. That said, I'm not sure how much of a session scene exists anymore. Eighty to 85 percent of the session calls I get are from outside the U.K. and mostly in the States, so I'm traveling anyway.

Are you seeing a trend toward having more real bass and drums on dates, and having the rhythm section record together, as opposed to overdubbing a part by yourself?

I think in the States there are more records with real bass and real drums. Thankfully people like D'Angelo and Raphael Saadiq are introducing generations raised on machines to real instruments. Other artists ask, "Wow, how do they get that feel?" You can't get it with machines. Personally, I try to make a point of taking sessions that have a live section playing together. That's always my first question: How are you going to cut the track? I'd say I do 75 percent live-section dates versus 25 percent overdubbing by myself. A lot of young producers bring me in with the idea of adding drums later, and I'll say, "Why don't you do the bass and drums together; that way we can work off each other," and they'll say, "Hey, that's a great idea." There is something to be said for coming in at the end and finding the space to put something special on the track, but I don't get much of that anymore, and it's mostly in Europe when I do. I'm open to both situations, but for me it's most satisfying to interact with a section.

How do you come up with parts? Do you think in terms of chords, melodies, or rhythmic ideas?

I just wait for something to come into my head. Sometimes I let the track play without any bass a few times to see if I can imagine the bass line, or I'll ask the rest of the rhythm section to play while I try to find a part. It varies; in the writing team I have with [keyboardist] James Poyser and [Roots drummer] Ahmir Thompson, we just play together until we mold something into shape, which is the most enjoyable way for me - reacting to whatever I hear. Technically, there's a degree of musical knowledge in the equation - knowing the changes and being aware that you can play something nice over this Em9 chord coming up. There are certain places in a song where each musician gets a little spark and thinks, "Well, I can put something special in here - this spot is where I can do my thing." The rest of the time it's a probably a good idea to just keep it simple.

Your work with D'Angelo symbolizes your move back to your R&B influences and fretted bass.

Well, as you say, my roots and the music in my heart has always been R&B. The move back really started around 1994, after I got my '63 P-Bass and put flatwounds on it. I'd been writing with [drummer] Steve Jordan, and I used the bass on a great album we did for Tom Jones that unfortunately never came out. [bonnie Raitt bassist] Hutch Hutchinson heard the tracks, and he recommended me to producer John Porter, who called and asked me to bring the P-Bass for B.B. King's Deuces Wild CD. That's where I met D'Angelo, and we hit it off in a big way. Whenever he sang, I played better! He said, "You've got the sound I'm looking for - come and play on my album" That was incredibly fortunate, because it also led to sessions with a variety of other hip-hop artists, and the formation of the writing team with D's sidemen, James and Ahmir.

D'Angelo's behind-the-beat grooves have intrigued many musicians. What light can you shed on the subject?

It's something D and Raphael Saadiq got from hip-hop - where the samples are not always in perfect time, creating a certain sloppy feel, which they incorporated into the way they feel music. Actually, that loose feel has always been around; I don't think it's anything new, really, but D's take on it and the way he arranged it on his tracks is the key - he brought it to the next level. For whatever reason, I took to the feel completely, and I felt fortunate to get it first-hand from one of the originators.

How do you approach the feel?

The only way I can play that style of bass, really hanging back, is for the drummer to sort of ignore what I'm doing. The tension is created by the drummer keeping the beat strongly in the middle and maybe even pushing slightly. If the drummer tries to hold back with me, the tension is gone. I like to feel the snare just on the edge of pushing, and then I can sit back in a certain space that makes the groove wider. It's not about listening to the drummer and playing an instant later; I'm still locking with the drums, but I'm feeling the groove in a different rhythmic dimension.

Has the hip-hop side of your career led you to any new techniques?

In a sense. I play with pretty much the same basic techniques, although I have a lot of different ways I touch the instrument now. It ranges from traditional two-finger plucking to a guitar-like fingerstyle approach where I pluck the E string with my thumb, the A string with my index finger, the D with my middle finger, and the G with my ring finger. And I'll apply my palm to mute the strings to varying degrees. That all developed from playing live, because the palm-mute and thumb or fingerstyle plucks were a way for me to bring down the dynamic level without having to turn down my volume. An interesting aspect of my P-Basses is that I play with the volume all the way up and a minimal amount of treble, and when I turn the treble off altogether it somehow gives the illusion that I've added bottom.

The fretless StringRay :

Pino Palladino, now at the forefront of modern fretless-bass playing, is perhaps most renowned for the enhancing phrases played on Paul Young's hit records, with his trademark Music Man bass, having taken up fretless whilst working with Gary Numan.

"I bought that one after I tried it out in the shop and it said 'Yes!' to me. Some basses you pick up and you know you don't want to play, but that one felt great... it was only $300! I'd tried out a few fretted Music Man basses before and didn't like them because they sounded too trebly, but I hadn't tried a fretless - they didn't make that many then.

Next time I go back to the States, though, I'm going to tell them to put the strings through the back. They are great basses. I love the sound, and a lot of people use them, but they're not that well-known. I think people regard them as boring; they are quite close to a Fender - in fact, they're just like an antique Fender - but they do have a sound of their own. The only other big player who uses them is Louis Johnson, he's always been a big thing with Music Man.

I don't know how old my Music Man is now, probably about 10 years old; in fact, the fella who sold it to the shop - Sam Ash's music store in New York - had walked in about an hour before me - it was fate."

Music Man vs. Pedulla :

Interestingly, and proving that the sound really is in the fingers, Pino did his first Don Henley session without his beloved Music Man.

"The reason I bought the Pedulla was that when I was out in America, I was asked to do some work with Don Henley. My gear had already flown home, so I didn't have a bass! He obviously wanted a particular sound, so I bought the Pedulla in the shop, practised with it for a bit - a few slap things - just to get used to it. When I looked at the neck, it was smashed up completely, all the resin was cracked! It sounds great, but I've only ever used the Pedulla in the studio. I'd kill it in about a week, once I started hitting it live. It's great for playing in the higher register, but it's not so versatile as the Music Man. Some basses go up to 26 frets, which is ridiculous! That range is great for soloing, for chords up high, but you don't get to do much of that, except in your front room."

On his famous bass part to Henley's later song, 'New York Minute', Pino actually used his trusty Music Man.

Intonation :

How did Pino deal with the problem of intonation on a fretless bass, given that many of his recorded bass lines were often first or second recording takes?

"I never really think about intonation: whenever I do, I play out of tune! If I really worry about it live - listening too hard to what I'm playing, rather than the whole thing - then it starts to get a bit sharp or flat, or whatever. It sometimes seems that, though the bass note may be right, the context makes it sound out. I don't really think about it in those terms; I just play until it sounds 'in'. Also, with fretless, you can do lots of vibrato, so a lot of the time, if you for a lick, up the top, you can give it a little shake to adjust the intonation, and it's more of an effect melodically."

So the intonation is totally fluid ?

" Yeah, it just happens. Some producers on sessions I've done get really touchy about it; they put the tuner up, play the bass track back and say 'It's a sharp there...' I always ask them whether it sounds sharp, because it really doesn't matter what it looks like on the tuner. A lot of the time on tracks I've done, 50% of the notes are out of tune but it sounds OK. It's like voice - never perfectly in tune, and a guitar will always be slightly out of tune as you move around the neck. It's hard to get one with perfect notes everywhere. On a fretless, it's up to you where you want to pitch it."

The Pino Sound :

"The sound I look for in an instrument is just something that fits in with the band. It doesn't have to be particularly good on its own, as long as it sounds like a bass. But a lot of basses I've tried have got parametrics and all that which you end not using, unless you solo - perhaps you'd use it more, then."

Practice exercises :

"The way I look at it, the most important thing is to play. You get these exercises you're supposed to do - squeezing tennis balls and so on - but the important thing is to play the bass when you feel like it. For four months I actually practised scales and played along with tapes, but only because I wanted to. I've never been the sort of person who slogs away at scales for hours a day."

String quartet :

"I like the sound of roundwounds - especially on a fretless - because they sing more. New strings are important if you're playing a part that needs a bright sound: slap or whatever. It's nice to have that sparkle from new strings. Often I've gone into the studio and done the first take with the strings that are already on, ones that may be a week old, then I'll put new ones on for the 'real' take, but what you gain on the top, you lose at the bottom."

Stage sound :

"Playing live is a compromise, and whenever I start touring it takes me three weeks to realize that! You never get to hear what you want, especially with playing with Paul (Young), because the most important thing is the vocal.

We have enormous sidefill monitors each side and, as soon as I move out of the line of the sidefills, I can't hear anything but voice; so I tend to stay back and adjust my position to get the sound. You have to be careful with monitors, though; you can have drums through them to keep time, but too many bits and pieces, and it's hard to get the out-front sound together with a good mix."

What about setting up EQ ?

"It varies from place to place. When I do the soundcheck, the sound man generally says. 'Could you lose to 100Hz' But, for me, that's the great sound - it's the bassy sound - though losing 100Hz makes it easier to get an out-front sound because bass rigs throw out a lot of sound out to about 16 - 20 feet away."

At the time, Pino worked with 2x15-inchers and 2x10-inch cabinets in a bi-amped set-up. "I back up the 10-inchers about half way, because they're too bright for me, and the 15-inchers give me 'oomph'. It's quite a bassy set-up actually - powerful,"

Effects :

"The only effect I use is a compressor: a dbx 163x. It's very simple, just one little slider control. I use it all the time, so that no matter how hard you hit the string, you get a pretty consistent volume level, which is important."

Did Pino's physical playing pressure alter very much ?

"I play quite lightly - until I slap, and that's when I wear my necks out!"

Why did Pino choose to slap on a fretless as opposed to the conventional route of a fretted bass? the answer is a practical one.

"I hate changing basses, live. I find it very distracting when the EQ changes. I prefer to stick with one bass and get the sounds out of that. I usually add a little treble when I slap, although it's not really a very bight sound - it doesn't sound like Marcus Miller or Mark King, or anything like that - it's more of a thud than a slap, but it works OK."

He also enjoyed altering the E-string tuning quite often on his basses.

"Down to D, yeah. The problem is that on a lot of songs we do with Paul, there's synth bass on the demo, usually with a low D or a low Eb. You really miss it if you try to play the D on the A string, fifth fret, because there's no bottom in it; so you tune down the E string. It gets tricky, because you have to alter position for the rest of the bass."

Hit records :

"Unfortunately, to get through to the masses, songs have to be reasonably simple; it can't be too complex, like Bebop or Jazz. It's a shame and could be because of the marketing, but I don't want to get on to record companies because I've no mercy for them - they're so full of s**t, they're unbelievable! I love music but hate the business, with a vengeance..."

The big gig attitude :

"Before I was successful, I thought I'd love to play on a big album and on lots of hits, but I think I've had more enjoyment from playing small clubs, going into a studio with friends and mucking about - that's a lot more satisfying. Also, I'm not really a performer; I can only really play while others are down the front giving it all that.

A lot of people would be surprised if they got out and did big gigs. For instance, with Paul you have to play the same thing every night, but you have to be consistently goof because most of the punters haven't heard the set before. You want to play as well as you can for them. It's playing by numbers every night."

Jaco Pastorius :

"When I got Jaco's first album, I didn't know what to think. I only liked about a quarter of it to start with - I was just amazed by the rest. He has a fantastic melodic sense in his writing, he's just a fantastic musician. I think he touched people.

I watched Jaco's teaching video with Joe Hubbard, from whom I'd had lessons when I wanted to learn more about jazz. I thought it was hilarious! Jaco sitting with Jerry Jemmott, who introduces him with a fantastic accolade. He turns to Jaco and asks whether he has anything to say, and Jaco says, 'Give me a gig, man!'. I was in stitches when I heard that. Then Jerry asks him to play 'Portrait of Tracy', and Jaco couldn't do it, saying, 'I've only played it a few times!'. Every other player in Christendom would have played it straightaway, and there's Jaco..."

Sound affects :

How significant did Pino think his unique bass-playing contribution was to Paul Young's then-considerable success?

"If I left Paul tomorrow, he'd still be successful. I know a lot of bass players say Paul Young's stuff is great because the bass is really interesting and that helps sell it, but I don't think it does. I'm not vain enough to think that. I'm not being over modest, either. Paul's a great singer and has a knack of choosing good songs."

Pop goes the bass :

"There's Anthony Jackson on 6-string bass, who's reckoned to be the greatest bass players in the world. It's probably true because there are no limits really to what he plays. i respect people like that - I think he's a fantastic player. there's a song called 'Night in Tunisia' by Chaka Kahn, and the bass lines on that! That's pop music to me - with all its restrictions - the bass lines are still phenomenal. Not flash, but Jackson's phrasing is unique! I've been lucky on Paul's album to be able to be quite indulgent, although always within the framework of pop. I haven't done it consciously - it's probably the producer more than me - but we spend a long time on some of the bass lines, looking for something that's different. Some producers are impressed if you go in, and do a bass line in the first few takes - 'Thank you, here's your money. You can go now,' but I don't get any of that. You may as well get a sequencer."

Session ideas :

"Sometimes, on a session, you play the first take and then the second. If they don't like them, you can try changing the approach rather than the riff - perhaps by using one note somewhere instead of two, or using a slidy approach like a synth, or there's the Octaver which is a different sound again. It's good to be able to offer producers different approaches because, that way, you can make the whole song sound totally different."

Edited September 4, 2015 at 11:07 AM by Nore

[KoZo]

Très intéressant !

[tophe]

+1

[Pol]

Merci bien

[Kamiko]

Ça c'est de l'interview!

[kuchbass]

[L'Oil]

Pour arrêter de se bra*ler sur son matériel. Un peu de théorie.

[pastaoune]

je viens de gratter dans son CV ( grâce à ce topic ) et je ne m'étonne plus maintenant d'avoir eu les oreilles attirées par cette ligne de basse.

[shaka38]

Pino + stingray fretless non?

[pastaoune]

Pino + stingray fretless non?

yes visiblement , pourtant ce n'est pas totalement son son de l'époque ( paul Young etc...)

mais il est référencé sur l'album

http://www.cduniverse.com/productinfo.asp?pid=1000192&style=music&fulldesc=T

[pastaoune]

plus actuel , jolie berceuse !

[linchoun]

Complètement d'accord pour le "rubato" surtout quand la basse débute

Mais a sa décharge, très compliqué d'accompagner.

[Guest Nore]

Quand le père n'est pas disponible, le fils prend le relai : Rocco (qui avait déjà assuré l'intérim quand "Père" assurait des dates avec les Who).

Edited March 20, 2016 at 09:09 AM by Nore

[kuchbass]

pinaizzzze ! je savais pas qu'il avait un fils bassiste !

[shaka38]

les années 80... mais il joue le Pino. (je ne sais pas à quoi tournait le guitariste....)

[oyezoyez]

C'est bon, ça ! Ouais, les clips des années 80, bonjour l'hallu.

Les suggestions youtioube m'ont amené à ce live du même titre. Tempo plus rapide, donc les riffs de basse sont moins mis en valeur, mais le groove est super solide. Et la fin du morceau...

[pastaoune]

(je ne sais pas à quoi tournait le guitariste....)

aux herbes de provence ? sinon , il me fait étrangement penser au gratteux d' UZEB ..

[pastaoune]

[Caracole]

Avec un son studio:

Placement rythmique...Que dire...Parfait, juste parfait. L'essence de la Funk.

Y'a tellement de bons techniciens de la basse qui ne savent pas jouer avec un batteur.

Quand on choisis la basse, on choisit aussi la batterie. Faut jamais l'oublier.

Edited September 30, 2016 at 10:33 PM by Caracole

[Stef B]

Les 2 albums d'Angelo sont des merveilles niveau groove. Voodoo à eu une énorme influence sur la suite des productions R'B / Funk. Seulement voilà, souvent copié mais jamais égalé, enfin c'est juste mon avis...

[gaille]

Pino (et James Gadson) à la section rythmique du dernier album de Bahamas : https://www.deezer.com/fr/album/54853852

Ou comment faire groover de la musique pour surfeurs & midinettes

 

 

[Stef B]

sinon, l'album de Chris Dave and the drumhedz bien que ultra produit recel qq perles de groove.

[garcimore]

 

Vu les prix délirant pour cet album, il y aurait il une âme charitable 

 

[JacoMiller]

Le 05/03/2016 à 15:07, L'Oil a dit :

 

Pour arrêter de se bra*ler sur son matériel. Un peu de théorie.

Elle vaut combien sa basse ? la peau du fion non ?

[axel faure]

Edit ... non rien, si c'est pour répondre a un troll comme je l'ai fait, mieux vaut ne rien poster du tout. Bonne continuation

Edited May 9, 2018 at 05:47 PM by axel faure